why do I see more style bashing?

[Bill Glasheen]

Do alot of Aikido people really think other systems are too violent?

Ive never met somone who does Aikido.

I have practiced and taught aikido. These days I don't do so much because I'm lacking the mats. But I take from it what I find useful.

That being said... Have you ever been in a Unitarian Universalist church? After having been educated in parochial school, I thought I'd never join an organized religion ever again in my life. My spouse wanted to get me involved in something before we got farther in our relationship, and turned me on to the UU church near UVa. It was pretty decent, being in an academic community. But when I moved from there to suburbia, it seemed to be more "fringe." It was a magnet it seemed for every odd politcal group not generally accepted in mainstream religions. I tend to agree with UU principles (more or less...), but found it difficult being part of a group that was "none of the above" in a suburban community. I couldn't relate.

Aikido schools CAN be like that. Given Ueshiba's philosophy of perfecting your art until you are so good that you employ self-defense methods that won't hurt your opponent, it COULD attract the "lotus eater" crowd in a community. I was lucky. I was taught by a former green beret with a mixed martial art background (judo, Goju, kobudo, etc.). And our class was primarily karate black belts from various styles interested in broadening their horizons. Plus, we did Tomiki method aikido which has a reputation of being a bit "rougher" than many aikido strains.

We learned all the same techniques that other aikido schools teach. But nobody invoked chi (qi, ki, fuzzy bunny energy, etc.). Everyone knew how to hit before they entered the dojo - to a fault. (I caused a broken leg and a torn meniscus, and got a separated shoulder). And nobody was a "patsy" for their partner in exercises. Either the technique worked, or it didn't. And when it didn't, then it was back to the drawing board.

My bias is that this "granola-headed arrogance" comes more often from the Qi Aikido people. In my personal experience I haven't seen much effective practice, and I just can't relate to all the qi nonsense.

Don't get me started...

It is my opinion that you shouldn't practice aikido until you have a dan in a striking style. Otherwise you'll be a part of a group seeking to tap into energy from partners incapable of generating energy. That doesn't work very well.

Some of the best aikido I've seen in a large group was with Clyde Takaguchi who teaches in the Bethesda, Maryland area. Like my instructor Dr. King, Clyde attracted dans from other martial styles to his school. He was open-minded, and loved to see how his art could be adapted to stylists from various branches of the martial family. I got a chance to work with Clyde for a while, but the drive was a bit daunting.

- Bill

[AAAhmed46]

Ueshiba was a badass in the trueist form.

[JimHawkins]

On a serious note..

Bill, what do you make of the strange expression, I can only think to call it, of the films of Ueshiba seemingly leading the uke around with his finger? I see Adam thinks Ueshiba was a "badass" but I know if Adam didn't know it was Ueshiba leading those folks around with his finger he'd call it something else.. And so would most of us, if we aren't anyway.. What's the deal with what looks like almost no contact Aiki that he does near the end? I admit I have a hard time buying that as much more than a cooperative uke who knows how to throw himself and more trouble buying that it would work against a good and well trained fighter. Polotics aside what is the deal with that?

As far as the Ki thing goes in Aiki.. I have an old film of Tohei and it is an educational video about 40 minutes and he always shows what he says is the path or vector of the Ki.. Now to me from the WCK it makes perfect sense to talk about this, not as Chi or fuzzy bunny energy but simply as a way to show what you might call the line of leverage or line of energy and change, something we teach in WCK. It’s just using the word “Ki” I think, to illustrate or say, “his energy <Ki> comes from here and we take it in this direction”—a vector. It clearly makes a big difference in how effective the technique is done--if the angle of the energy flow, leverage, lead etc is right on the money so is the move.. So, I don't really see anything mystical there--just good instruction re energy, position and vector.

[Bill Glasheen]

Bill, what do you make of the strange expression, I can only think to call it, of the films of Ueshiba seemingly leading the uke around with his finger?

In a word, it's marketing.

Ueshiba practiced well into his nineties, and did demos on film at that age. It's tragic that we weren't able to capture the strapping young man with such great athleticism on film. By the time the media was there to record, all we had was a white-haired man who was a source of considerable wisdom but not necessarily the best prototype of execution.

On the other hand...

• Yes, his students showed considerable ukemi skills in those videos. That is not to be discounted. I was always taught that the ukemi comes before the waza. In advanced jiujitsu and aikido, your ukemi actually can be your offense. Bruce Hirabayashi's student Sal (my grand student...) is a rokudan in Nippon jiujitsu and a BJJ practitioner. Sal (a.k.a. Bornsinner) gave some of the most entertaining sessions to the Germans when George, Bruce, Sal and I paid them a visit. It was a thing to behold, and Sal is quite the performer.
• One of the things Ueshiba shows in these demos is what happens if you insist on holding on to the opponent. A wise fighter will not. Someone who doesn't know better can be led around like a dog on a leash. It appears almost magical, but it isn't. It's actually a principle in Uechi Ryu (stemming from the closed-temple-gate posture) that takes a while for most Uechika to figure out. It's not in the wrists; it's in the legs. Watch the legs!
• It IS possible to lead most anyone around by their finger, or toes for that matter. These techniques BTW are illegal in the MMA matches, so that should tell you something. It's no different than leading a bull by the nose ring. With the human, one of two things happen: 1) you follow the finger - often with great athletic skill, or 2) the finger breaks/dislocates. But, you ask, does it work in real life? One of my female students at UVa was attacked by a would-be rapist, and applied the finger bend technique. Option 2 happened. The would-be rapist subsequently fell down in pain (along with my female student), and then got up and ran away. It wasn't "pretty" like in the film, but mission accomplished.

As for the use of ki as a metaphor, well I agree. Heather (a.k.a. uechiwoman) and I have great conversations along these lines. Heather is a fine Uechika and also a licensed, practicing acupuncturist. We have no problem communicating, and we are quasi-bilingual with each other.

- Bill

[benzocaine]

Young O Sensei Videos do exist.

[JimHawkins]

Thanks Bill..

It IS possible to lead most anyone around by their finger

I actually meant that Ueshiba would seem to lead them around with *his* meaning Ueshiba's finger..

Thanks for the vids Ben, will check them out..