Martial Arts Professional

Bill's forum was the first! All subjects are welcome. Participation by all encouraged.

Moderator: Available

Post Reply
Valkenar
Posts: 1316
Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2000 6:01 am
Location: Somerville, ma.

Post by Valkenar »

Bill Glasheen wrote:Then imagine yourself telling it to someone with dual faculty positions at a university who taught martial arts as a representative of one of those departments. And remember that the same person was a student at that university and got some of his education (including in Uechi) at that university.
"appealing to one's own authority is never legitimate."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority

I've never been impressed with this kind of argument, and hopefully will never try it myself. I greatly respect your opinion and experience, Bill, but that doesn't mean I'm going to accept what you say as gospel on every issue. In this case, I think you're wrong, and the reasons you've given aren't compelling. "Trust me, I know" is not compelling.
Do you still stand by what you said? Is it still "apples and oranges" in your mind?
Yes, at least in most cases. Specifically, the difference between them means that what's appropriate and neccesary in a university setting (penalizing non-attendance) may not be neccesary and appropriate in a recreational activity setting. This isn't going anywhere and I don't want to derail the thread anymore than it is, so this is the last I'll say about this particular issue (university vs. commercial dojo).
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Sigh...

I am not asking you to appeal to my authority. Please re-read my post.

I started learning Nippon Shorin Ken karate at The College of William and Mary. I continued learning Uechi karate at the University of Virginia. My first martial arts instructor subsequently got a Martial Artist in Residence position at Old Dominion University. I subsequently got a faculty position at the University of Virginia as an instructor in the Department of Physical Education. That's a degree-seeking program, BTW. One can get a bachelors, masters, and doctorate in that department.

By the time I got my first instruction outside a university setting, I was already ikkyu in two different martial arts. Getting my shodan in Uechi was a formality, thanks to David Finkelstein. I then went back to the University of Virginia and got the faculty position where I could continue the martial arts program through the Physical Education Department. Meanwhile I continued my martial arts training via myriad sources (Dave, George, Dr. King, Robert Smith tai chi, Raffi, etc.).

I also picked up a handful degrees (3) in engineering, and got a faculty position in cardiology. I then left the university and worked as a professional scientist in industry and opened a few martial arts schools in various health clubs.

So, Justin, please tell me what book says Universities and Martial Arts dojos are apples and oranges. Please define your "apples" and your "oranges" in your argument.

By the way, Justin, where did you learn Uechi Ryu? Where is Vinny teaching Uechi these days?

Did you not get why I posted this picture?

Image

We won't conquer the martial arts world if our heads are stuck in that box. Already we find many, many dojo paradigms just in this one Forum thread - thanks to the many contributors.

Time for a refreshing paradigm shift? :wink:

Image

- Bill
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Dojo means place. It is any place where you practice your karate.
- Hiroshi Hamada, 8th dan, Ph.D.
... Martial Artist in Residence
... Old Dominion University
cxt
Posts: 1230
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 5:29 pm

Post by cxt »

Not meaning to beat a dead horse--but an "appeal to authority" is sometimes quite OK to invoke.

If one has lengthy, formal training/education in a given subject--then its not fallcious to refer back to that training/education.

Alwys subject to questioning and review of course.

But having training/education in a specific area does not mean that you CAN'T draw on it in discussion.
JOHN THURSTON
Posts: 2445
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 1998 6:01 am
Location: MARSHFIELD, MA. USA
Contact:

Good Info

Post by JOHN THURSTON »

Well,

It is certainly obvious that I have much to learn.

Sensei Fred was nice enough to visit Thursday, I am sorry I missed him.

Hopefully i will learn.

jt
"All Enlightenment Gratefully Accepted"
User avatar
John Giacoletti
Posts: 448
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:08 am
Location: Largo, FL

Disclaimer

Post by John Giacoletti »

I'm not quite sure how this diverse thread has devolved into the present contract issues.

I originally posted a notice concerning a feature cover article in the October 2006 Martial Arts Professional:The Trade Journal of the Martial Arts Industry that focused on my Sensei, Kycho Ric Martin and his daughter Erica.


Subsequent posts that I've made in the thread are my personal opinions and not necessarily those of Sensei Martin or the MARTIAL ARTS PROFESSIONAL.

Some readers seem to have interpreted the diverse points of discussion in the thread as Sensei Martin's beliefs and that's simply not the case.

If parties can't resolve differences in a Win-Win settlement, and realize the benefits of synergy, it's best not to compromise one or the other's values and settle for something less than Win-Win. A Win-Lose or Lose-Lose are not satisfactory resolutions. Coming to no agreement is better than agreeing to a proposition in which one of the parties loses.

The other side of the coin in Bill Glasheen's statement and Dana's statements of persons being potentially disparaged by my remarks concerning the future of samller schoos is that those same persons may also be potentially envious of someone else's hard work and success.

If one checks the numbers, most start-up small business enterprises fail. Most new dojo soon go out of business. When the WalMart and Target move in, the smaller private enterprises go under.

The future of Karate schools lies in the hands of those individuals and organizations that have a demonstrated survival record under diverse market conditions over time.

The Chinese sage Tien T'ai wrote:
Given enough time, any man may master the physical. With enough knowledge, any man may become wise. It is the Warrior who can master both ... and surpass the result.
.
There is much to make of every moment.
Stryke

Post by Stryke »

Devolved John ?

it`s actually evolved , once the nonsense was taken care of .
MikeK
Posts: 3664
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:40 pm

Re: Disclaimer

Post by MikeK »

John Giacoletti wrote:The future of Karate schools lies in the hands of those individuals and organizations that have a demonstrated survival record under diverse market conditions over time.
That is correct, so let's form up into lines by rank and do kata by the count. :lol: Been there, done that and you can keep the t-shirt.

Somehow or another karate managed to survive, grow and thrive for a long time without big full-time schools. While the future of "karate schools" may be in the McDojo (as in franchise schools) the future of karate is in the hands of those who love teaching what they know. And that can happen anywhere.
I was dreaming of the past...
User avatar
Rising Star
Posts: 280
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: Townsend, MA
Contact:

Post by Rising Star »

While the future of "karate schools" may be in the McDojo (as in franchise schools) the future of karate is in the hands of those who love teaching what they know. And that can happen anywhere.
So true!

John
It's what we do!
fivedragons
Posts: 1573
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2005 7:05 am

Post by fivedragons »

Here's a karate school.

Image
MikeK
Posts: 3664
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:40 pm

Post by MikeK »

Looks very much like the one that I train in each week. :D And look at all the fine weapons within arms reach!
I was dreaming of the past...
benzocaine
Posts: 2107
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2003 12:20 pm
Location: St. Thomas

Post by benzocaine »

Forget smelling some other guys sweat... that outdoor dojo is nice and ventilated. 8)
Willy

Post by Willy »

Yeah smells great until you slip in the bear schit.


Image
benzocaine
Posts: 2107
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2003 12:20 pm
Location: St. Thomas

Post by benzocaine »

Willy wrote:Yeah smells great until you slip in the bear schit.


Image
Yeah... keep an eye out for anything that resembles these...

Image
fivedragons
Posts: 1573
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2005 7:05 am

Post by fivedragons »

That picture smells like a forest. :lol:

I just got back from karate class. By that I mean that I just got back from a nice 2 or 3 mile run through town. :)
Post Reply

Return to “Bill Glasheen's Dojo Roundtable”