Gates

[Randy Pelletier]

Wow,

What a great thread with fantastic information from very respected folks. Most interesting!!

[John Giacoletti]

This is a very informative and historically interesting series of posts.

I occassionally train with "ishi sachi", or stone padlocks.

Maybe it's a stretch, but I can't help make the connection between a closed or locked gate and the ishi sachi.

That connection being that through training one can lock and unlock the gates.

http://www.bushifitness.com/equipment.htm

Exactly how do these stone locks work? Do they loop through wooden handles on the inside of the gate?

[f.Channell]

John,

Could be that the stones are used to counter balance the weight of the door and are not actually locks?

I frequently visit a store which imports Chinese items and are always impressed by the mass, size and weight of these huge doors.

I imagine the gates are even larger.

F.

[John Giacoletti]

Thanks Fred. Certainly could be... the weight of the stone keeps the door from swinging open freely. I'd like to see how they hook on though.

The ishi sachi I use are like light dumbells. I don't see how they could hold a door or gate closed

I get a good shoulder work-out doing small alternating circle blocks as I step going from a right hand to a left hand kumai.

[JimHawkins]

Well closed gate in the terms I know them would refer to an open centerline as in the way most people do the sanchin guard. In this "guard" it "gives centerline" so the main <center> gate is open but the flanks are guarded.

If you close the guard/gate, by bringing the elbows into the center more and/or with “blading,” or otherwise by bringing the hands or structure together, as in the arrow shape to close off the centerline, etc., then that would be a closed main gate <front door> vs. an open gate, assuming one is not referring to some other specific gate and closing IT off by filling, etc.

[JaySal]

Hello Dana.

Please note the below from Bob Campbell.
*********************************************

Hello Dana

Greetings for the Land where Dragons can still be found.... if one knows just
where to look !!!!

I would like to apologies as my last email was riddled with mis-spellings and grammar infractions having typed that message out whilst on the telephone and signing the occasional bank Transfer orders to fly across my desk...... which seems like ever minute to me on most days.

Decades before the Boxer Rebellion and during the Boxer Rebellion, a period considered the Zenith of Chinese Martial Arts..... style were
merged, blended, shared, copied and if you use just about ant term that denotes, mix-n-match blend and stir..... styles over lapped so those
who believe ANY STYLE is pure unto itself, are either very much misinformed or not very well read in the history of events that unfolded in China and the practice of Martial Arts from the mid 1700's up to the fall the last Emperor, Pu Yi, during the late 1930's......

It should be noted that Martial Art training was NOT for the educated, upper classes of Chinese society.... it was mainly practiced by the merchant class and other lower, uneducated classes in China for many Centuries

Dana, If you see movements that look similar to those from other styles.... than you are 100% correct.

I welcome any and all questions so please do not hesitate to contact me directly ( robert@oln-law.com ) or via my most trusted friend, Sensei Jay Salhanick

May the sound of Ten Thousand Thundering Dragons awaken the thirst for knowledge in all of us......

Strength and Honor

Bob Campbell
Hong Kong

[Dana Sheets]

Where to begin? I'm full of a thousand questions.

OK - I think this one would be of interest to many people.

The Uechi arm rubbing & pounding exercise really looks, to me, like step one and two of an exercise that would continue to many levels. In Southern Mantis I have seen this exercise taken to higher levels of training.

For example - the traditional pattern of this exercise is to do the arm rubbing, bow, and then begin pounding.

However if you start with arm rubbing and then move to where one partner is striking and the other redirecting and stirking then you have a circular pattern of training the bridge and response at a tactile level (without stopping and hitting and breaking the flow.)

Then, also in Southern Mantis, they add footwork and body movement and variety. So the partners are able to start with rubbing, move to striking and deflecting in a fixed pattern, and then move to striking and deflecting and countering in a non-fixed pattern. (Does that make sense?)

So at first it is trained that the one arm stikes. Then the arm strikes and deflects the counter. Next the one arm strikes/deflects the counter/and counter strikes.

And at the higher level you start to alternate which hand strikes and which hand deflect and which hand counters...all the while knowing that it could be just one hand that does all this.

So the short version:
Is our arm rubbing and pounding exercise level one and two of something that should be taken out of a fixed stance posture and used with more variety and flow?

[Stryke]

So the short version:
Is our arm rubbing and pounding exercise level one and two of something that should be taken out of a fixed stance posture and used with more variety and flow?

Dana I`ll butt in and say yes .

I do it this way , there was a clip of Gem doing it and showing the use of body mechanics far more advanced than whats usually shown .

After McCarthys tegumi drills and exploring other styles mantis etc , I`m sure Kotikitae is a remanant of a sensitivity and application drill .

the rubbing very similar to the cross hand absorbtion drill , and the blocking sequence a transfer drill .

I`m also playing with inside hooking and the mantis hand ...

I think IMHO it should be a Uechi essential .

even just addint the footwork and playing with entrys would create a whole new level of skills

[John Giacoletti]

The Uechi closed gate position is left hand over right closed fist, is it not?

Just as a check, I looked at the Univ. of Virginia web site where it described as left over right

And the left finger tips extend over, not just cover the right set of knuckles. The finger tips locking over the knuckles provide for a strong, solid grip.

Robert Campbell seems to indicate that it's just the opposite ... that the right hand covers the left fist.

the right palm never closes or wraps around the left fist as we do in Uechi San Chin )

Just an aside ... interlace your right and left hands. Is your left or right thumb on the top? I'm a left on the top person but there are just as many persons who place the right thumb on the top.

Does it really matter which hand covers which in the closed gate?

How is the closed gate position tested?

[JaySal]

Hello Dana.

Please note below from Bob Campbell

Take care - Jay

********************************************************

Hello Dana

I have encouraged all my students to ask questions of me ever since I can remember in the mid 1960's......

I fully realize some Uechi people do not take this view......,

Do as your told,

Question not... anyone Senior to you in so far as their authority or knowledge.

I totally disagree with those views and I encourage all students and martial art friends to ASK ANY QUESTION they want. I am a Karate Teacher, not the Head of State so no one needs to walk on eggs around me or any of my Senior Students.....

We are all, No Gate-Open Gate mentality

Bonki's: I have stopped teaching all of the Uechi Bonki's for over 15 years now.

The Bonki's, with great respect to everyone, are not today part of my fluid training style as I find them too rigid and not practical in my humble view.....

I agree the Bonki's are good for Kyu ranks but we need better training, better application and much more dynamic movement interpretations

We need Uechi Street Fighting Bonki's..... not folk dancing Bonki's as some teach today!

Again, these are my personal views.

My Seniors continue to teach the Bonki's as they are required for Dan test purposes.

As far as creating your own Bonki's.... Dana I say with great vigor, YES....... Go For It !!

Remember Dana, after the rank of Shodan, it's YOUR KARATE, your way of thinking, your methods and your interpretations.

Challenge yourself Dana, step forward, express your views and adapt your style so it meets your Martial Art needs.

I no longer make corrections in any form on my Senior Students, they are all 6th Dans and above.... if they have not mastered their Karate, ways..... by now, they never will and I am exceptionally proud of everyone of them

You must one day train with Jay Salhanick 7th dan, Darin Yee 7th dan or Michael Aceto 6th dan.... they are NOT reproductions of me, they are each different in their own methods and applications and I venture to say, you will find them to be a breath of fresh air in your Uechi training.

I will be in New England this summer, Jay Salhanick is the Vice President of our Uechi Ryu Karate Association - Hong Kong.....

I cordially invite you, Dana, to attend our functions..... bring your friends or students most importantly bring your questions
and ideas, if you like, you can speak or communicate directly with Jay regarding our calendar of Events.

ALL ARE WELCOME regardless of Affiliations.

Strength and Honor

Bob Campbell
Hong Kong
Keeper of the Dragon's Beard

[Dana Sheets]

First off, thanks for the invitation. As soon as I know the dates and times it will go on my calendar. Secondly thanks for the kick in the tail. I've waiting too long to start this project and let myself be distracted by too many other things. And thirdly, thank you for the challenge.

Won't it be fun to step up to this challenge? I hope, happy forumites, you'll help me by sharing your ideas, answering my questions, offering constructive and well stated critiques, and asking questions. And since most of you here are my seniors please know that I am very open to anything wiser minds have to say.

Please know that I'm not going for the super, most advanced ever training drill. I'm going for some stepping stones into flowing movement.

My vision has these elements
- continuous flow drills based off of arm rubbing using Uechi principles.
- a continuous two person set for Seichin. I'll start with Seichin for the kata based drills because it is my favorite kata (gotta love author bias,) has the fewest esoteric moves, and the fewest historically ingrained bunkai for the general Uechi world.
- and eventually, two person sets for Seisan, and Sanseiryu using HAPV attacks and Uechi principals as counters.


These elements would serve as stepping stones towards completely non-prearranged patterns of movement. So using the flow drills to move towardsparkour for Uechi.

And since I make videos for a living I can't resist saying that if, Bob Campbell, you ever choose to bless the Uechi community with a book or a video, we'll all be the better for it.

So step 1:

- continuous flow drills based off of arm rubbing using Uechi principles.

If you come up with one or several and would like to share them please do so on the new thread on my forum which will be there every day to remind me to stay on task.

One final thought:
Let us not say anything further about why a traditional Uechi drill may or may not be to your liking. That is small conversation and one that doesn't go anywhere. Let's move forward with a larger conversation on what we can create together.

Happy training,
Dana

[Stryke]

http://www.kung-fu.co.il/english/external/article7.asp


Some more information on the gates , in a strategic sense .