.............compared to men, of course. You might get the odd exception, but generally 99% of the time it holds true, women are weaker physically.
There are some things women are better at than men...their reflexes are quicker.....and sports wise women hold all the records for long distance swimming, but punching...well, I don't think so, mindframe or whatever.
That's not to knock women...it's just to say that it is a problem to be faced.
The same problem will be faced by any man who is put upon by some man larger than themselves. I don't know what the solution is........ I'm still looking
Our equipment may not be the same, but many of the issues that we face are.
Dont fall into the trap of thinking that the only way to generate power is through strength. Power can be generated through speed, strength or a combination of the two.
"Men are stronger than women", if true, would lead one to believe that all men are stronger than all women. The above statement is not true, but a more acccurate statement would be that the average man is stronger than the average woman. Problem is I have never met an average woman or man, only those of us who are above or below average.
In physics, Kinetic Energy (the energy of motion) is equivalent to one half the mass times the square of the velocity. The ramification of that statement is that if one doubles the mass of an object (say a fist), the kinetic energy of the fist is doubled. If on the other hand, you double how fast the fist moves, but keep the weight the same, there is four times as much kinetic energy. How do you double the weight of your fist (put more weight behind it). This argument ignores body mechanics entirely, I understand, but hopefully demonstrate a useful idea.
Also very interesting is the physical defintion of pressure. Pressure equals the force divided by the area. Apply a force of one pound over a large surface and you will get very little pressure, but appply the same one pound to the surface area of the head of a pin and you get a a lot of pressure (which is why it is so easy to stick someone with a pin but really hard to do the same thing with your fist).
Most people get stronger as they age, but also get slower as they age, up until the point at which both strength and speed decline. I am 36 years old. I am considerably stronger than I was at age 18 (when I began studying Uechi-Ryu), but slower. When I was 18, I was fixated with the notion of developing strength so that I could develop power. Over the years I came to think that while power is useful (especially in the martial arts), it is not everything.
One of the things that I learned over the years (and, no, I did not learn it from my mother, a feminist historian), is that women can be equal to men without having to do everything in exactly the same fashion as men.
It is my assertion that men are more like women than they are different. As such, many of the issues affecting women are the same as the ones that affect men. Therefore, women AND men can be valuable allies in addressing the issues that affect all of us.
For me, the reason that I responded in this thread is my firm belief that the issue of "Why cant women hit hard" is really an issue of "why many women and men cant hit hard"
IMHO, By focusing only on the issue of women, you may lose natural allies (men of below average strength). As a man of below average strength, I was hoping that folks might learn from how I deal with my problem of not being able to hit hard.
I hope that you wont judge me by my gender beofre you hear what I have to say.
That is an interesting post, thank you for detailing your explaination and shring your own theory and personal information.
One thing I am still trying to understand is not so much the "Why cant women hit hard" or "why many women and men cant hit hard" issue but as I asked earlier 'compared to what'.
Your argument and scientific explaination of physical differences and principals is understandable but what is the standard that is set to calibrate who punches harder, or generates more power. Is this knockout power?
I am not making an argument here because I know through life that pound for pound men are stronger physically and most people know this, I think. Thats why the guys over the years did the heavy work, ha ha ..well it goes a lot deeper than that but not now ...
The answer to the question could be possibly found in setting up a test by teaching proper punching technique using all characteristics outlined for developing a solid punch and generate power to novice group A and let novice group B just whack away at a bag and in the air. If group A and B are all woman then we will find out why group B 'can't punch hard', or why some in group A failed to develop. Possible reasons, improper instruction, and or not understanding physical concepts in developing the punch. The same can be said using men as a trail. But then again, if we are looking for strength because of mass you can probably take someone off the street that may for the first time punch with more power than a trained student of the arts. Although they may not be able to generate as much power or look as pretty it will still hurt the same.
Reading about how to do something is not the same as getting out and doing it with proper instruction and assistance in learning.
ultimately the question being asked is .....How do we make our ma's effective? how much strength do we need to accomplish that?...and we come up with so many,many variables. we don't know who will attack us and whether our technique will be effective against them for numerous reasons, they will probably be larger than ourselves and maybe younger and stronger as well. I don't think that you can count on your punch......and if it takes you years to learn how to do it...what do you do in the interim, if you are unfortunate enough to be attacked? When I first came into the martial arts I thought that everything was well thought out by experts who knew exactly what they were doing, that every stance and manoeuvre had thought and purpose behind it. But it doesn't........there are some karate styles that quite frankly, I could invent in an afternoon.
I have been told in some clubs to stand with my hands dangling by my side in a long low stance......this is supposed to be a good fighting stance????
What I now do is take what I want from where I want it, I move like a boxer
and use elbow strikes as quickly as I can......I only use boxing type stuff as a lead into elbows...and I like open handed strikes...a nukite to the eyes will end a fight very,very quickly
Thanks for taking the above in the light it was intended. I would like to think that I understand the issues, and if I am lucky, I may learn something.
Years ago I was doing some research. I have a weird way of doing research, though. I go to the library, look up some books based upon a particular topic, and then go looking for them in the stacks. While in the stacks, I start pulling down any book I find that looks interesting. These interesting books in the neighborhood are not exactly on the same topic as the initial search, but can bring some useful info.
One day I was looking for books related to martial arts and self defense, especially as it related to women and children when I came across a pretty old book on dance. Ordinarily a book on dance says little towards developing a self defense mindset or other useful stuff but packed away in some obscure chapter was something that was so approapriate to martial arts training that I still remember the gist of today.
The chapter of interest was describing the different body types (keep in mind this book was written in like the fifties or something) as it related to dance (while I was interested in the different body types and how it relates to self defense and martial arts). For a lack of the proper terminology of today or of then, and to simplify, lets call them, skinny (like a rail), medium, & heavy.
Each body type has distinct advantages and disadvantages (according to the book). The skinny person, for example, gets cold very easily, but has trouble keeping limber and therefore has to strech a lot more than some folks; the skinny person also has a lot of trouble developing strength (sound familiar). The heavy person, is better insulated (and thus stays warm), develops strength more readily, and even has less trouble with stretching, but has trouble with cardiovascular workouts (their heart must work harder than others). I am recalling from memory at this point, so dont try to memorize, just get the idea that for every body type their are advantatges and disadvantages
The most crucial observation the book made related to how body type affected one's performance in ballet. The book was crititical of ballet because Ballet, at least in certain traditions (western) limit the dances done such that only those really skinny folks can hope to succeed in this form of dance. In other words, mediium or heavy folks need not apply, but of course sometimes medium or heavy folks do try to do Ballet and invariably run into a wall (the wall of thin, lets say). Many dancers become anorexic, bulimic (sp?), or acquire some form of eating disorder in an attempt to starve themselves into a different body type. Why? Because the dance has eveolved into one most suited to a particular body type, rather than being dance which is of sufficent variety such that people of varying body types can hope to be successful.
Outside of ballet, in other dance traditions, it was noted that in any particular dance studio, the majority of students have a tendency to mimic the body type of a given instructor. Why? The theory was that if an instructor was of a particular body type, they would tend to gear the lessons or workout to their own particular strengths. That which the instructor was good at, that would be the priomary focus of the class. Those students who shared a similar body type tend to find the same activities easier, and thus were successful. Those students who were of a different body type would often find the focus of the class difficult to accomplish, and thus may self select themselves out of the class. Interestingly, the instructors, tended to downplay those activities that were hardest, but also most necessary for their body types.
How does that apply to martail arts? It is my theory that, if not done carefully, the students of a given martial arts instructor tend to mirror the body types of their instructors. We all want to be successful. We tend to focus on those things we do well and, especially when other folks are around, we would have a tendency to give less attention to those things that are harder for us to be successful. This is human nature.
Knowing the above, it can be understood why everyone else in a martial arts class might be able to hit hard and you might be the only struggling to develop some power. You might be of a different body type trying to compete.
The book suggested that we get to know the strengths and weeknesses of our own body type and especially work on those areas of weekness (might be outside of class). At the same time, you may not be successful in a class whose instructor focuses on the strengths of a single body type.
Two more things. Body types can change. I am not as bone thin as I was when I started karate back in the 80's. Dont expect it to change overnight and dont expect it to stay the same for life.
Finally, I have to admit something here. When I was 19, all I was interested in was hard hitting karate. I was not very impressed with soft martial arts or even the finer points of half hard, half soft. All I wanted to do was learn how to hit hard. Problem is, I am getting a lot closer to 40 than 20, and all of a sudden, I am viewing strength as merely a single component to a healthy and safe life, despite the fact that I am stronger now than I was when I started. (at least alittle).
Talk may be cheap. It is definitely important to go out on the dojo floor and "Just do it", but the importance of thinking, talking, & writing cannot be underestimated. When the BG is closing the distance, that is the time to act; you can think of which strategy to employ, but dont try to come up with any new strategies as the BG is closing the distance with bad intentions, you wont have time.....
Why Cant Women Hit hard? That was the intial question.....How can women develop effective, adaptive strategies, that can affect a woman's self defense that may include hitting hard, but also recognising a whole other realm of possibilities.
I am not a woman, so I wont pretend to know exactly what it is like to be one, but like many men who participate in the "Women And the Martial Arts" discussion area, I am also interested in knowing how training can be altered, or supplemented to improve its effectiveness for women. I want my wife to know how to protect herself, for example, but how would I get her into a dojo (cant get her away from her computers)? I dont want to hurt her, but I hope she would be more interested in such things.
Here are some strategies for everyone to be able to hit hard: Know your limits (so you dont injure yourself as you learn) with what strikes you can hit. Most of us cannot hit full force with our fist, but can still use more force than you can with only a one-knuckle punch (which will take a long time to use with confidence).
Keep practicing, be careful, you will get stronger, in the meantime, learn how to get all of your body behind your strikes. If your just punching using the upper body msucles and not using the lower body muscles as well, you will have only half the mass, and will have thus sapped half the power.
Learn about other martial arts, what they have in common, how they are different. learn about other sports which have some rather thinly weiled martial applications. Learning how to harness your power, getting your full weight behind your strikes can come through these others means (like the young girl whose lassoed those criminals recently on the other thread.
How hard you hit wont matter if people sneek up on you, so awareness can be as crucial as how hard one hits. Awareness will be useless if and when the BG pushes the envelope, invades your space, attempts to elicit your funds, or attempts to be indecent, at that point, hitting hard becomes useful, but not entuirely necessary.
In your awareness of approaching BG's, you may come to an understanding of a negotiation that sometimes occurs between people on a non-verbal, often subliminal basis. Here's how the negotiation goes....BG is hanging out along your way home, hoping for a little cash to get some sedative, narcotic, alcohol, nicoteine, whathaveyou, you meekly walk by like you just came out of a university lecture and you did not want to disturb anyone taking their final exams, and the BG swaggers over to you gesturing with arms, hips, shoulders, and head in a haughty way suggestions physical strength and virulence. Its practically a challenge, not necessarily to your manhood, cuz you are above that (err, not susceptible let's say), but you may come to feel physically intimidated and only understand vaguely why. They have not said any indecent laguage yet, made any overt aggressive overtures, made any assaultive remarks and yet you may feel threatened. This is all happening in split seconds, BG wondering if he can get your credit card (via robbery), a few dollars, or maybe hit you up for a cigarette, while you are tyring to figure out what are the intentions of someone who is closing the distance between you and them in subtly aggressive gestures and how do you respond?
Mimicking these subtly aggressive gestures can work sometimes, not all the time, in avoiding an altercation. Life is not long enough for you to fight every battle, only fight those battles you absolutely need to. Turning to face your attacker, as is a highly common Uechi practice, is in and of itself, a highly assertive and successful strategy and may deter those who needed a little more convincing that you should not be "messed with".
If you cant generate the power that you anticipate your BG will, then you dont want to fight em straight up, face to face. You may pretend that you will, then turn and run and then turn and attack the BG as the BG was chasing you. Its partly psychological, partly physical......
During the negotiation, you want to let it be known, directly or subliminally, that you will fight physically to protect yourself, if need be. You may relish the idea or you may be dreading the idea (of kicking out his kneecaps, of shattering his wind pipe, of his enjoying fatherhood), or something in between, but you will make it known that you intend to protect yourself from the BG.
But the message is not so simple as trying to strut or pretend that you are the biggest, baddest dudue or duddette on the street. Rather than putting on the face of a fierce warrior certain of victory against his foe (which you may or may not be), but rather wear the face of a weary office worker, homemaker, student, scientist, doctor, lawyer, day care provider, telemarketer, whatever who doesnt want to be messed with and who will take a beating as well as give one out. Maintain the attitude that while I may not win all my battles, or even this one, one thing is certain, if you take me on, I am gonna hurt ya, hurt ya good and hurt ya plenty. I may or may not be strong (sometimes I feel stronger than other times) not be strong and may not be pretty, but I have taken beatings from some of the best and I dished out my share of punishment to a few as well, if you intiate this dance. Be aware of tricks designed to distract you while they jump u. "excuse, do you know what time it is?" while you look down at your watch, they try to jump you. You dont have to be totally aloof, can just step backward a half step as you check you watch (be aware)...
If the BG wants to dance, let's dance. But since I dont really want to dance, I may express my displeasure by yelling at him (which wil increase your strength and hopefully alert attention that may be benefical [yell "fire", never yell "rape", people may thing you are joking-it has happened]), or I step on his toes,
For me the two most poweful weapons are the elbow and the knee, or if I can hit em with the ground, that's even better, but that only works if they try taking "the big swing". When the BG takes all the force in their whole body and puts it into a single devastating blow (taking a big swing), you have the chance to jamm em up before they throw or of getting out of the way and possibly countering by using their force agaisnt them (aikido, jujitsu, etc.)
The wrestler, grappler, BG, wants to take you to the ground where it may be easier to your their weight advantage to limits you from runnning away. But to take you to the ground, they must get inside yourdefenses, and/or trip you. They may come causually up to close distance and then spring on you, closing the distance bewteen the two of you as soon as possible. If you use your knees and elbows as they are trying to take you down, their forward motion can be used to increase you hitting power. What is stronger, your tiny little wrist, or your knee? And dont feel bad for them if they started it, chalk it up to instant karma, a product of the 21st century?
The boxer can be scary (see thread at Van Canna site about a book about boxing as a martial art). While the boxer is not entirely against throwing many punches like the Bg who makes "the big swing", they do so selectively. Boxers generally hit with combinations of strikes that individually are not all that powerful, but combined, begin to have cumulative effect. I think what can be learned from that is that, if we cant become super duper strong, maybe, if we use combinations of strikes more often, we can be successful. Mathematically speaking, we cant possibly all be the biggest toughest person in the city, in your neighborhood, at your school.
KNow what works for you and train with it the most until it becomes the patterned to 1st choice in your "primitive brain", if you have to go there. Let's hope it does not go there. But your readiness to go there may affect how often you actually go there.
