Lower Gate

[benzocaine]

I've been doing a little reading about Wing Chun lately and started thinking about how the form Si Lum Tao (their first form)starts off with crossing the lower gate with the hands.


The folks I currently study with do the same thing for their sanchin Kata to begin the kata.

I know that Sensei Glasheen ends his kata by (forgive me if I'm wrong) closing the lower gate.

What is the significance of all of this? Is it all symbolism? Does it have some spiritual meaning in that you are protecting a chakra or something like that? It's probably not to much of a big deal, but it's still something I don't understand. Any info would help. Thanks.

[HALFORD E. JONES]

From mylimited understanding, this position is conducive of several things probably. First, it is a sort of protection of the testicles/groin area,possibly a chakra,etc. Secondly, there is some symbolic aspect to it,signifying some completion possibly,from which a new beginning can also be had? We all have done this sort of thing in forms of various schools and if we can relate this aspect, this one detail, to the whole, then perhaps we will have a greater understanding. That is what knowledge consists, that is, objective knowledge. I shall have to ponder this further but I hope others will give their take on this and their experience.

[Bill Glasheen]

Actually, Ben, you make a good observation. Finding that in Wing Chun is the clue.

My finishing motion comes from doing Shorei Kai Goju Ryu and by getting a move I picked up there reinforced by Bob Campbell.

The way I see it, Ben, much of Wing Chun is about occupying the center line. That's a center line, mind you, and not a center point. This means that the closed gate, the upper double-handed movement, and that lower gate movement all define the center line. Put your hands anywhere on that line and your arms at the right angles, and you've defended merely by being there. It's not chi, and it's not magic; it's simple geometry.

That's why I do it anyhow. And Wing Chun is similarly no BS, and to the point.

There are other things to be read into that position, but then I can't give away ALL my secrets...

- Bill

[benzocaine]

awww no majical meanings behind it??

I thought it would be good to ask. Well, this gives me another thing to ponder..

[Evan Pantazi]

Wing Chun is also based on Eastern thought and method, including Dim Mak & Kyusho. The lower gate also is associated with the 3 warmers in acupuncture terminology. And another level of understanding the Art and it's ideas.

I just don't want you to be limited in thought and I did not come to stir the pot.

[Bill Glasheen]

Evan, you are always welcome in my home, and your comment is very appropriate.

Note that I was holding something back... I wasn't just joking. You and I can come up with some lower gate attacks that are "kyusho-based", although we may see why they work just a tad differently. I alluded to one on Dana's seisan reengineering thread.

When I show students this posture in sanchin, I don't tell them what attack can come of it. Why? Because they do the motion like an attack. Then their brain is frozen, and they can't see anything else in the posture. My personal philosophy in kata is to make the movement general so information storage and retrieval can be accomplished in the most efficient manner.

It's difficult sometimes explaining the attacks w/o actually having a partner to work with.

- Bill