the psyche of sparring

[Guest]

[Glenn]

Not many practitioners get to that point. In fact, many would duck that kind of competition, or any competition at all, proclaiming that they"fight for real" _ ever heard that kind of BS?

In an attempt to get this thread back on topic:

I find it interesting that the more vocal pro-competition folks around here, who would presumably have the experience to contribute a lot to threads about competition such as this one, all too frequently prefer to bring the thread down to this pointless topic. Competing is not the be-all or end-all of the martial arts, and the reasons for not competing are just as diverse and complex as the reasons for competing. Yet it seems no one can bring up the topic of sparring and competition without someone feeling the need to mention their pet peeve against people who do not compete, and unfortunately that tends to redirect what could have been a meaningful thread. As was mentioned in the original post, trying to get information about the mental side of competing just gets passed over.

The above quote contributes nothing to a discussion of mindset while sparring/competing against skilled opponents. As a novice when it comes to competition I for one am interested in this topic and would like to see more about it.

Now hopefully the seasoned competitors will take this challenge of sharing their knowledge, rather than continue on focusing on pet peeves.

[TG]

"...WE HAVE DELUSIVE PRACTITIONERS_ like the one who would go into supermarkets, dressed in a gi, and try to kick cans off shelves...

That IS a joke, right?

TG

[Bill Glasheen]

Unfortunately probably not. But I'm betting that was something from the past. (I've seen some doozies of my own...)

Fortunately most of the mistique is gone from martial arts these days. That happened with rank inflation, cinema saturation, and the UFC. Now it's just a martial arts class - as it should be.

The flakes follow the latest popular trend.

- Bill

[Bill Glasheen]

Glenn

How about we take that half-empty glass, and turn it upside down.

Jay Leno on occasion repeats a joke whenever he can get away with it. The popular ones, of course, are always about sex. The joke will go something like this.

An article in this month's Cosmopolitan magazine reports on the 10 things you can do to amaze your man in bed. Yea, and they guarantee you'll leave your man satisfied.

I'll tell you one thing a woman can do...SHOW UP!!!

Believe it or not, we all have more or less been saying the same thing. (About fighting, of course... )

Take the problem on in a controlled setting. Don't jump into the dog pit right away where you are going to get spanked and reinforce all your bad habits. Find multiple ways to work with all your fears. Once you're comfortable at one level, go on to the next. And then the next. And the next...

Of course you need good instruction along the way. Without it, you run into a lot of trees. That's not very productive.

At any one point in time, you will define your limits of what you are and are not capable of. Then over time, you add layers of knowledge on to where you are, and bring the lessons back to "the field." Over time, you find those boundaries shifting. And then before you know it, you are in a place you never considered being in the past.

Much wisdom will be picked up along the way. That's probably the most valuable lesson.

- Bill

[TSDguy]

In fact, many would duck that kind of competition, or any competition at all, proclaiming that they"fight for real" _ ever heard that kind of BS?

The above quote contributes nothing to a discussion of mindset while sparring/competing against skilled opponents.

Once a certain type of conflict has become more or less routine, it no longer triggers the adrenaline surge.

[TSDguy]

That may have been a little too vague. In my opinion, it doesn't matter WHAT you tell yourself, until you go just DO it. You can't possibly climb into a ring for the first time (/defend yourself) against a big guy and expect to not be scared or intimidated, no matter how much you pump yourself up.

[Van Canna]

find it interesting that the more vocal pro-competition folks around here, who would presumably have the experience to contribute a lot to threads about competition such as this one, all too frequently prefer to bring the thread down to this pointless topic.

Hey Glenn, it is not a pointless topic. There is a history to this that you have missed…

Lots of the ones who don’t compete, have gone on record to say that the competitors can only do sport and not self-defense fighting, mental, or physical.

Competing is not the be-all or end-all of the martial arts

True, but it is extremely useful in molding a complete martial artist, for a number of reasons that must be experienced, in order to understand.

Do yourself a favor Glenn, and buy the book “How to master Bruce Lee’s fighting system” by Joe Lewis [the legend]_ then read chapter six, the science of movement_ strengthen your position_ entrap an opponent_ avoid and reset_ refocus, regroup and recover_ etc.

the reasons for not competing are just as diverse and complex as the reasons for competing.

Sure, to each his own..Glenn, just as long as you don’t take the position that those who do are not doing real karate..but you are not doing that..So you have nothing to be concerned with.

without someone feeling the need to mention their pet peeve against people who do not compete

It is about the pet peeve of the ones who don’t compete against the ones that do, Glenn.

As was mentioned in the original post, trying to get information about the mental side of competing just gets passed over.

It doesn’t Glenn..review Stryke’s posts..Very good stuff..

And the one by Bill…that’s a good one. And in order to grasp the mental side, it helps to look into the window of the ones who have diverse and complex reasons not to enter the arena.

[Van Canna]

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Those who cannot fight --> coach.
Those who cannot coach --> fight.
Those who can do both --> revolutionize.

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Coach Sonnon added to experience as a US National Coach for two combat sports, and his experience as a Distinguished Master of Sports.

Coach Sonnon brings a rare opportunity to enhance your game, no matter your style! Whether from MMA, NHB, Vale Tudo, Kickboxing, Muay Thai, Shootfighting or any other style of fighting, regardless if you interest lay in self-defense, close-quarters combat, or subject control, this shall be the most powerful accelerant to your performance ever!

Go for it Glenn...

[Stryke]

If were talking about competitve mindset and preparing for competition , lets have some questions .

The fact is everyone is different , you have to realise your mindset and what it takes to get you to your optimum state .

the beauty of this is it gets easier with practice , In fact i think i can pretty much do it instantly now , given the right motivation

Some folks get to worked up before a competition , myself included , my personal atttitude is to treat it like a joke , karate games , I physically prepare for a big tournament (past hence) about three months out , the mental side takes about a week for me .

i do very little physically in the week up to a tournament , i will have a ok/good workout about twice early in the week , in the last three to four days I will do little to nothing . This takes care of the physical for me , up to that point I have been actually overtraining , building to a peak , the abrupt stop of training makes me extremely itchy to do more , the recovery period gives me more energy and speed than I realised .

But the mental , im very anxious to get it on by this stage , I tell myself Ive done everything I can , This realisation has to come IMHO , same with self defence , the realisation you have everything you are going to posess and it`s no point worrying about it .

Myself I`m to intense leading up to a competition , I remember in the early days getting so worked up i would actually throw up before a competition through nerves , so my attitude is to discredit it , see it as the game it is , enjoy the training for the training and the comp as something I just have to do , I go to the tournament joke around with friends and old adversaries , and spend time helping the less experienced competitors deal with there nerves and get them to the right place .

All this detracts from what I am doing , it`s not about me but just relaxing with friends and enjoying the day .

As the event gets closer , i get more introverted , i dont think about the comp though just try and loosen , I do little warm up , just enough to get moblie , it`s all about looseness and relaxation , to much gets me to aggressive and tense .

I`m feeling loose and tired now , the pressure is gone , it`s gonna be over soon , ive done all i can , I am physically quiet and restfull , those that know me recognise it , they leave me alone and I`m usually sitting there yawning almost asleep when it comes time .

It`s time before I realise , time to play .... the competitors line up , I see everyone watching , maybe theres other fights first , I watch , always looking for the good points , putting myself in a positive mindset . People i recognise , people i dont , It`s along day waiting for the last division .

it`s my turn i step up , the adrenilan has started , its on

GET OUT OF MY RING

[Glenn]

The fun thing about pet peeves is that it is easy to trigger those who have them!

TSD and Van,

I understand the benefits of competing, and it can be an interesting topic in and of itself, my point is that it is pointless to harp on people who do not compete in a thread that assumes you are already in the ring. Yes it takes a particular mindset to get into the ring in the first place, but this thread started with someone seeking info on how to manage your mindset AFTER you get into the ring.

Hey Glenn, it is not a pointless topic. There is a history to this that you have missed…

Lots of the ones who don’t compete, have gone on record to say that the competitors can only do sport and not self-defense fighting, mental, or physical.

True, but it is extremely useful in molding a complete martial artist, for a number of reasons that must be experienced, in order to understand.

Sure, to each his own..Glenn, just as long as you don’t take the position that those who do are not doing real karate..but you are not doing that..So you have nothing to be concerned with.

It is about the pet peeve of the ones who don’t compete against the ones that do, Glenn.

While there is that segment out there, I have yet to see it in either yours or Bill's forums. Its the pet peeves of the ones who do compete against the ones who don't that dominate here. Definitely shows the preferences of the vocal participants on these forums.

It doesn’t Glenn..review Stryke’s posts..Very good stuff..

And the one by Bill…that’s a good one. And in order to grasp the mental side, it helps to look into the window of the ones who have diverse and complex reasons not to enter the arena.

Yes there were a couple good post initially, but then the thread got sidetracked. I just assumed there was more that could be contributed by the seasoned competitors and tried to get it back on track...with some degree of success it seems!

Thanks for the book and link info, those should be useful.

Go for it Glenn...

My problem is that I don't have the competitive spirit/drive when it comes to sports. Never have, hence why I have never participated in any sport. It has nothing to do with intimidation by an opponent, its about not having that desire to win a game. And if you don't have the desire to win, there's not much point in stepping into the ring...unless you just want to provide someone with an easy victory.

[Stryke]

Sorry Glen i would of posted anyway , i havent been sidetracked by anything , in fact i agree with Van .

there are a lot of reasons to compete , and a desire to win isnt necessary , in fact many say it`s a bonus in sparring .

It`s just a good venue to test what youve been training , see if it works , and remedy it if it doesnt

[Van Canna]

My problem is that I don't have the competitive spirit/drive when it comes to sports. Never have, hence why I have never participated in any sport. It has nothing to do with intimidation by an opponent, its about not having that desire to win a game. And if you don't have the desire to win, there's not much point in stepping into the ring...unless you just want to provide someone with an easy victory.

I understand.

But the desire to win in competition goes a very, very long way in opponent domination /control in a real fight.

It also makes you learn to deal with "being put to the test" under adversity.

The fights of the 60s [Joe lewis/Chuck Norris days] were blood baths..you fought to survive...like at the Madison square Garden's All American...eyes hanging out, fights in locker rooms, riots on the floor..

[Guest]

My problem is that I don't have the competitive spirit/drive when it comes to sports. Never have, hence why I have never participated in any sport. It has nothing to do with intimidation by an opponent, its about not having that desire to win a game. And if you don't have the desire to win, there's not much point in stepping into the ring...unless you just want to provide someone with an easy victory.

I'm not much of a tournament guy, did a few, didn't do well, got thrown out of most of them.

Did a little boxing, did a little better, but didn't have it in me to hit folks hard enough to make them pay attention.

Even in dojo sparring I tend not to go hard on folks,I take it too lightly and get nailed by people that shouldn't be capable of landing on me.


Then one day I got jumped and was beaten and stomped. It's changed my out look.

When I pair off now I can use that, If I make my opponent one of those guys with the lumber, I become someone many would rather not face.

I also imagine my oponent as someone who is going to rape my wife and children, as someone who also wants to cost me my job as someone who is trying to negatively effect my ability to provide for my family.

I can't wait for the match to start! Let me at that piece of crap!

I still will have problems getting thrown out. But when I harness this rage I have no problems going too light.

Works well with strangers but, I still go too light on my dojo mates. I seem to only have two positions on my switch, and knowing it I can not do this vilifying with friends.

Turning the opponent into a threat has helped me up the aggression. But unfortunately the animosity I create also causes me to toss the rule book. But it might work for you Glenn.If you have a hard time competing then don't play that game, put your mindset in the I can not loose space instead.

[Van Canna]

But..what's a real fight?

I'll tell you. Two guys with hoods and a metal bat, suddenly attacking a pizza delivery man a few days ago, in a sleepy New England town. Left him down senseless in his own blood, stole the pizza and his money.